Post by Kiwi Frontline on May 18, 2016 8:14:01 GMT 12
Taranaki Daily News Letters 18/5/16
VOTE ON MERIT
I don’t care what colour, race or planet you’re from. If you’re good enough I will vote for you.
Of critical importance is that anyone who is in public office must have the capabilities, skills and experience to increase the collective pool of ‘talent’ tasked with running said office.
Simply having an interesting opinion, lineage or pastime is not enough to be entrusted with the decisions of our province.
Councillors with anything less than actual experience and knowledge to make logical decisions are a waste of resources and race has certainly shown no propensity for guaranteed skills when looking at many past councillors who have excelled at being paid – Pakeha public office pests.
Race knows no bounds with incompetence and delusions of grandeur.
There is some incredible talent amongst local Maori and contrary to Mayor Judd’s recent public relations disaster, I damn well will vote for a Maori candidate if he or she can do the job better than I imagine I can.
Any action that diminishes racism should be a good thing but Judd has handled this very badly and taken us all down with him inadvertently and collectively tarnishing New Plymouth residents via the media as ignorant rednecks.
Big deal if you’re a recovering racist, you are not unique in making mistakes in life. Get on with your epiphany in your own time whilst the rest of us enjoy the company of our life long Maori mates. What a clown.
J G
New Plymouth
ALL ONE
Maori, Pakeha; we all bleed the same colour, so what’s the real difference.
P G
New Plymouth
GLAD JUDD’S GONE
It is good to see Mayor Andrew Judd is not going to stand for mayor at the next elections.
When a Mayor can’t accept a binding referendum of 83 per cent against a separate Maori ward in the district, then he is out of touch with the people that elected him.
When you get people on council that impose their own views on the community then there is a problem with that person.
This mayor and those councillors voted in favour of Maori wards should also be removed from office as they will be a danger to the city.
I B
Wanganui
WHO’S THE SCOUNDREL?
Danny Keenan adopts his usual racist position in claiming (TDN, 12/5/16) that democracy is not a victory for minorities. Has he forgotten that on the present District Council there is a Maori member, voted in by the majority?
His claims about Maori voting rights in the early colonial period confirm his ignorance. Initially, only adult males (including Maori men) with a property qualification had the right to vote. As this excluded many Maori who held land in common, the Maori seats were introduced giving all Maori men voting rights when many Europeans had none. Probably their number was proportional to the number of others with the vote.. His claim that there should have been 15 is speculation.
Then he misquotes Dr Samuel Johnson who actually said ‘‘Patriotism is the last refuge of the scoundrel.’’ So who is the actual scoundrel?
BRUCE MOON
Nelson
THANKS HEATHER
Thank you to our deputy mayor Heather Dodunski (TDN, May 12) for supporting the bulk of our district’s citizens who reject being branded racist. Matt Rilkoff (editorial) and others have drawn the clear distinction that the poll was not a call to ban Maori councillors, but that they be elected in ‘‘open’’ vote. Unfortunately, the mayor’s belated personal learning curve (epiphany?) has been allowed and encouraged, to dominate our local affairs and news to an unwarranted extent.
To Danny Keenan of Whanganui who quoted ancient history, and perhaps too, to the supporters of Maori wards, I suggest that they defer to more recent history, when just prior to local government amalgamation there were numerous councillors of Maori descent, including deputy mayor of Waitara, who were all elected in an ‘‘open’’ system. And they weren’t elected or regarded as ‘‘ Maori’’ councillors, just good citizens working for their communities.
Keenan despairs at the working of democracy as how he views it, but he needs to embrace it, and widen his outlook. Numerous wise people have claimed, that in spite of its shortcomings, it is by far and away the best system on offer.
Apart from now being one much larger authority and more difficult for an individual candidate to be widely known, not too much has changed, other than waning public interest and increasing apathy.
Times and peoples’ attitudes do change, and it is good to have the current mandatory six-yearly review of representation in local government. That is probably frequent enough, especially considering the furore caused by the last one!!
D M
Waitara
BOTH SIDES
Andrew Judd, Mayor New Plymouth claims to be a ‘recovering racist’. The public outburst is the result of a backlash to his initiated referenda to have Maori seats on council, in which he was roundly defeated. Whilst he is entitled to his private opinion he was elected to promote democracy, not separatism . There is nothing in the Local Government Act which denies Maori from standing and being elected to council. How does Andrew explain Winston Peters’ ongoing electoral success?
Andrew might consider reading both sides of the story. Te Tiriti o Waitangi and the now authenticated Littlewood draft which undeniably is the English draft of 4th February 1840 would be a good place to start. Nelson Mandela spent his life promoting ‘equality’ for his people not ‘speciality and separatism’ as tribal interests have been promoting since 1975 when New Zealand’s Treaty history was rewritten.
M J A
Tauranga
WARDS IN ACTION
Congratulations to the people of New Plymouth for dissuading Andrew Judd from standing for public office. It is surprising that he managed to become mayor when he apparently had so little regard for democracy. To better understand what he had in mind in his enthusiasm to create a Maori constituency, let’s look at what has happened in other councils which have already done that.
The Eastern Bay of Plenty Regional Council has three Maori constituency seats and eleven ‘general’ constituency seats. In the 2013 local authority elections it took 2804 votes to get three councillors in Maori seats, or an average of 934 votes each. By contrast, it took an average of 10,049 votes to get a councillor in a general seat.The Waikato Regional Council in 2013 had 12 general seats and two Maori seats, it took on average 1243 votes to gain a councillor in a Maori seat and a average of 9,053 to gain a councillor in a general seat. There are many other examples. Voters who cast their ballots in the general constituencies could be forgiven if they gained the impression that their votes were almost worthless. This inequity would have arrived in New Plymouth had Judd’s plan succeeded.
My view is that if councillors are going to sit around the same table, get paid the same, and make decisions affecting the whole community, then they require a mandate from the whole community. What more proof do we need that this profoundly undemocratic form of electoral welfarism needs to be got rid of?
G L
Hamilton
CROWD WISDOM
Tamati Coffey said on Seven Sharp recently ‘‘Maori are under-represented in local government, while the ‘tyranny of the majority’ reigns’’.
As Dr Muriel Newman (NZCPR) has pointed out in one of her newsletters, ‘‘extremist minority groups often raise the spectre of the tyranny of the majority in their call for special government favours’’. But that’s a cop out. A population is made up of individuals, each with their own individual views that need to be respected. That they concur with others over how their country should be run to make up a majority, is not a crime but a strength. The majority view is the summation of all of the individual minority views. It’s not tyranny – it is the wisdom of the crowd.
GEOFFREY T PARKER
Kamo
Dominion Post 18/5/16
REVERSE RACISM
I am appalled by the blatantly slanted article by Dave Armstrong (May 16); it matters not what sort of car Mike Hoskings drives. nor where he lives - he is deserving of an opinion.
You also make a point of saying that if Maori were to stand for election like anybody else Pakeha won't vote for them. Rubbish. New Plymouth District Council has councillor Howie Tamati, elected on his own merits, not his race.
Mayor Andrew Judd was defeated in his bid to introduce Maori seats on the council by democratic vote: once by his own council and again by public referendum. He then wrote to the United Nations on the subject. This mayor is not the hero you are trying to make him out to be. To have any race-based seats on any council is a form of reverse racism in itself.
J W
Levin
TO THE POINT section
* Dave Armstrong (May16) advises that "New Plymouth is the centre of a region with a large Maori population but little Maori representation". There is no reason that the large Maori population can't select Maori candi-dates and vote for them. Why discard democracy in favour of more racial preference? It didn't work in South Africa, why would it work here?
N H
Thorndon
* Our democracy is precious. When any person by reason of ethnicity is placed - not voted - on to a local council and allowed to vote, it is not a democratic act There should be no laws based on race in a democratic country. Democracy has flourished so far but we must beware of those who wish to destroy it.
I F,
Island Bay
* It is likely that the outcome of the New Plymouth poll on a Maori ward shows support for multiculturalism over biculturalism. Those who see this as ingrained racism are wrong.
M W,
Tawa
Waikato Times 18/5/16
MOKO’S DEATH
Good luck to the Waikato Times editor in his campaign against child abuse and murder. Kiwis have been here before. He should focus on Maori abuse of children -this is the real issue.
Take out the Maori figures (5.75 times higher than European) and New Zealand has the lowest abuse figures in the OECD. Maori have an under class who have normalised violence, most clearly seen in gangs. Currently 24 percent of all Maori males in their 20s have done jail time - a triumph of the hippo campus over the frontal cortex.
It is time to confront the fact that violence is endemic in parts of Maori society. There's nothing new here. On the facts presented in the Moko case, the "social worker" was naive and gullible to the point of negligence. She ignored red flags. "Trained social worker"? Really?
How serious does a case have to be before children are actually visited? Mahia Te Tomo describes herself as a "manager". Does she have any proper qualifications? Who is being less than open about what really happened? They seem to have forgotten the most important thing children.
M L
Hamilton
PARTNERSHIP DEALS (Also in Hawkes Bay Today 18/5/16)
Are ratepayers aware that their rates help pay their councils’ membership to Local Government NZ?
In August 2015, LGNZ president Laurence Yule signed a memorandum of understanding with the Freshwater Iwi Leaders Group. Local Government NZ has done a deal to create partnership obligations to councils involving "economic development, environment, infrastructure, employment, social issues, health, housing, energy and local democratic representation and decision making".
Meanwhile, the Ministry for the Environment, at Nick Smith's direction, sent a group of ministry employees around the country to "consult" the community about Freshwater.
The deal is done and the Iwi Leaders Group's seven outrageous demands are virtually signed, sealed and delivered thanks to Local Government NZ. Democracy is being sorely undermined when LGNZ can ignore 75 per cent of the ratepaying public in their wishes to not have representation based on ethnicity.
M J A
Tauranga
NZ Herald 18/5/16 (Short & Sweet section)
ON LIFE
Dame Anne Salmond finds inspiring the Whanganui Treaty settlement whereby a river is “recognised as a legal person with rights of its own”. This in the same country that denies such legal personhood and ensuing protection to the unborn child. Am I the only person who despairs of modern madness?
D G,
Beach Haven.
Wairarapa Times-Age 18/5/16
TEXT section
■ so good to see Jim Rimene in WTA May 16.1 agree with everything he said. John Key got it wrong with the flag. Masterton council has got it wrong with allowing 2 iwi to be present at meetings etc etc. They must be voted on to council by the public which includes Pakeha and our Maori friends. Problem solved. Good on you Jim Rimene and Gary Caffell
■ If Maori want 2 bon Council why dont they put their names forward and be democratically elected as everyone who wishes to be on council does. ■ I'm none the wiser after attending 'SuperSeniors' today and why was Alastair Scott there?
Hawkes Bay Today 18/5/16
TEXT US section
■ Treaty settlement. Who's going to gain from that? Should set up jobs for everyone, not just you leaders. Whanau should set up education programme for those struggling to keep kids at kura.
VOTE ON MERIT
I don’t care what colour, race or planet you’re from. If you’re good enough I will vote for you.
Of critical importance is that anyone who is in public office must have the capabilities, skills and experience to increase the collective pool of ‘talent’ tasked with running said office.
Simply having an interesting opinion, lineage or pastime is not enough to be entrusted with the decisions of our province.
Councillors with anything less than actual experience and knowledge to make logical decisions are a waste of resources and race has certainly shown no propensity for guaranteed skills when looking at many past councillors who have excelled at being paid – Pakeha public office pests.
Race knows no bounds with incompetence and delusions of grandeur.
There is some incredible talent amongst local Maori and contrary to Mayor Judd’s recent public relations disaster, I damn well will vote for a Maori candidate if he or she can do the job better than I imagine I can.
Any action that diminishes racism should be a good thing but Judd has handled this very badly and taken us all down with him inadvertently and collectively tarnishing New Plymouth residents via the media as ignorant rednecks.
Big deal if you’re a recovering racist, you are not unique in making mistakes in life. Get on with your epiphany in your own time whilst the rest of us enjoy the company of our life long Maori mates. What a clown.
J G
New Plymouth
ALL ONE
Maori, Pakeha; we all bleed the same colour, so what’s the real difference.
P G
New Plymouth
GLAD JUDD’S GONE
It is good to see Mayor Andrew Judd is not going to stand for mayor at the next elections.
When a Mayor can’t accept a binding referendum of 83 per cent against a separate Maori ward in the district, then he is out of touch with the people that elected him.
When you get people on council that impose their own views on the community then there is a problem with that person.
This mayor and those councillors voted in favour of Maori wards should also be removed from office as they will be a danger to the city.
I B
Wanganui
WHO’S THE SCOUNDREL?
Danny Keenan adopts his usual racist position in claiming (TDN, 12/5/16) that democracy is not a victory for minorities. Has he forgotten that on the present District Council there is a Maori member, voted in by the majority?
His claims about Maori voting rights in the early colonial period confirm his ignorance. Initially, only adult males (including Maori men) with a property qualification had the right to vote. As this excluded many Maori who held land in common, the Maori seats were introduced giving all Maori men voting rights when many Europeans had none. Probably their number was proportional to the number of others with the vote.. His claim that there should have been 15 is speculation.
Then he misquotes Dr Samuel Johnson who actually said ‘‘Patriotism is the last refuge of the scoundrel.’’ So who is the actual scoundrel?
BRUCE MOON
Nelson
THANKS HEATHER
Thank you to our deputy mayor Heather Dodunski (TDN, May 12) for supporting the bulk of our district’s citizens who reject being branded racist. Matt Rilkoff (editorial) and others have drawn the clear distinction that the poll was not a call to ban Maori councillors, but that they be elected in ‘‘open’’ vote. Unfortunately, the mayor’s belated personal learning curve (epiphany?) has been allowed and encouraged, to dominate our local affairs and news to an unwarranted extent.
To Danny Keenan of Whanganui who quoted ancient history, and perhaps too, to the supporters of Maori wards, I suggest that they defer to more recent history, when just prior to local government amalgamation there were numerous councillors of Maori descent, including deputy mayor of Waitara, who were all elected in an ‘‘open’’ system. And they weren’t elected or regarded as ‘‘ Maori’’ councillors, just good citizens working for their communities.
Keenan despairs at the working of democracy as how he views it, but he needs to embrace it, and widen his outlook. Numerous wise people have claimed, that in spite of its shortcomings, it is by far and away the best system on offer.
Apart from now being one much larger authority and more difficult for an individual candidate to be widely known, not too much has changed, other than waning public interest and increasing apathy.
Times and peoples’ attitudes do change, and it is good to have the current mandatory six-yearly review of representation in local government. That is probably frequent enough, especially considering the furore caused by the last one!!
D M
Waitara
BOTH SIDES
Andrew Judd, Mayor New Plymouth claims to be a ‘recovering racist’. The public outburst is the result of a backlash to his initiated referenda to have Maori seats on council, in which he was roundly defeated. Whilst he is entitled to his private opinion he was elected to promote democracy, not separatism . There is nothing in the Local Government Act which denies Maori from standing and being elected to council. How does Andrew explain Winston Peters’ ongoing electoral success?
Andrew might consider reading both sides of the story. Te Tiriti o Waitangi and the now authenticated Littlewood draft which undeniably is the English draft of 4th February 1840 would be a good place to start. Nelson Mandela spent his life promoting ‘equality’ for his people not ‘speciality and separatism’ as tribal interests have been promoting since 1975 when New Zealand’s Treaty history was rewritten.
M J A
Tauranga
WARDS IN ACTION
Congratulations to the people of New Plymouth for dissuading Andrew Judd from standing for public office. It is surprising that he managed to become mayor when he apparently had so little regard for democracy. To better understand what he had in mind in his enthusiasm to create a Maori constituency, let’s look at what has happened in other councils which have already done that.
The Eastern Bay of Plenty Regional Council has three Maori constituency seats and eleven ‘general’ constituency seats. In the 2013 local authority elections it took 2804 votes to get three councillors in Maori seats, or an average of 934 votes each. By contrast, it took an average of 10,049 votes to get a councillor in a general seat.The Waikato Regional Council in 2013 had 12 general seats and two Maori seats, it took on average 1243 votes to gain a councillor in a Maori seat and a average of 9,053 to gain a councillor in a general seat. There are many other examples. Voters who cast their ballots in the general constituencies could be forgiven if they gained the impression that their votes were almost worthless. This inequity would have arrived in New Plymouth had Judd’s plan succeeded.
My view is that if councillors are going to sit around the same table, get paid the same, and make decisions affecting the whole community, then they require a mandate from the whole community. What more proof do we need that this profoundly undemocratic form of electoral welfarism needs to be got rid of?
G L
Hamilton
CROWD WISDOM
Tamati Coffey said on Seven Sharp recently ‘‘Maori are under-represented in local government, while the ‘tyranny of the majority’ reigns’’.
As Dr Muriel Newman (NZCPR) has pointed out in one of her newsletters, ‘‘extremist minority groups often raise the spectre of the tyranny of the majority in their call for special government favours’’. But that’s a cop out. A population is made up of individuals, each with their own individual views that need to be respected. That they concur with others over how their country should be run to make up a majority, is not a crime but a strength. The majority view is the summation of all of the individual minority views. It’s not tyranny – it is the wisdom of the crowd.
GEOFFREY T PARKER
Kamo
Dominion Post 18/5/16
REVERSE RACISM
I am appalled by the blatantly slanted article by Dave Armstrong (May 16); it matters not what sort of car Mike Hoskings drives. nor where he lives - he is deserving of an opinion.
You also make a point of saying that if Maori were to stand for election like anybody else Pakeha won't vote for them. Rubbish. New Plymouth District Council has councillor Howie Tamati, elected on his own merits, not his race.
Mayor Andrew Judd was defeated in his bid to introduce Maori seats on the council by democratic vote: once by his own council and again by public referendum. He then wrote to the United Nations on the subject. This mayor is not the hero you are trying to make him out to be. To have any race-based seats on any council is a form of reverse racism in itself.
J W
Levin
TO THE POINT section
* Dave Armstrong (May16) advises that "New Plymouth is the centre of a region with a large Maori population but little Maori representation". There is no reason that the large Maori population can't select Maori candi-dates and vote for them. Why discard democracy in favour of more racial preference? It didn't work in South Africa, why would it work here?
N H
Thorndon
* Our democracy is precious. When any person by reason of ethnicity is placed - not voted - on to a local council and allowed to vote, it is not a democratic act There should be no laws based on race in a democratic country. Democracy has flourished so far but we must beware of those who wish to destroy it.
I F,
Island Bay
* It is likely that the outcome of the New Plymouth poll on a Maori ward shows support for multiculturalism over biculturalism. Those who see this as ingrained racism are wrong.
M W,
Tawa
Waikato Times 18/5/16
MOKO’S DEATH
Good luck to the Waikato Times editor in his campaign against child abuse and murder. Kiwis have been here before. He should focus on Maori abuse of children -this is the real issue.
Take out the Maori figures (5.75 times higher than European) and New Zealand has the lowest abuse figures in the OECD. Maori have an under class who have normalised violence, most clearly seen in gangs. Currently 24 percent of all Maori males in their 20s have done jail time - a triumph of the hippo campus over the frontal cortex.
It is time to confront the fact that violence is endemic in parts of Maori society. There's nothing new here. On the facts presented in the Moko case, the "social worker" was naive and gullible to the point of negligence. She ignored red flags. "Trained social worker"? Really?
How serious does a case have to be before children are actually visited? Mahia Te Tomo describes herself as a "manager". Does she have any proper qualifications? Who is being less than open about what really happened? They seem to have forgotten the most important thing children.
M L
Hamilton
PARTNERSHIP DEALS (Also in Hawkes Bay Today 18/5/16)
Are ratepayers aware that their rates help pay their councils’ membership to Local Government NZ?
In August 2015, LGNZ president Laurence Yule signed a memorandum of understanding with the Freshwater Iwi Leaders Group. Local Government NZ has done a deal to create partnership obligations to councils involving "economic development, environment, infrastructure, employment, social issues, health, housing, energy and local democratic representation and decision making".
Meanwhile, the Ministry for the Environment, at Nick Smith's direction, sent a group of ministry employees around the country to "consult" the community about Freshwater.
The deal is done and the Iwi Leaders Group's seven outrageous demands are virtually signed, sealed and delivered thanks to Local Government NZ. Democracy is being sorely undermined when LGNZ can ignore 75 per cent of the ratepaying public in their wishes to not have representation based on ethnicity.
M J A
Tauranga
NZ Herald 18/5/16 (Short & Sweet section)
ON LIFE
Dame Anne Salmond finds inspiring the Whanganui Treaty settlement whereby a river is “recognised as a legal person with rights of its own”. This in the same country that denies such legal personhood and ensuing protection to the unborn child. Am I the only person who despairs of modern madness?
D G,
Beach Haven.
Wairarapa Times-Age 18/5/16
TEXT section
■ so good to see Jim Rimene in WTA May 16.1 agree with everything he said. John Key got it wrong with the flag. Masterton council has got it wrong with allowing 2 iwi to be present at meetings etc etc. They must be voted on to council by the public which includes Pakeha and our Maori friends. Problem solved. Good on you Jim Rimene and Gary Caffell
■ If Maori want 2 bon Council why dont they put their names forward and be democratically elected as everyone who wishes to be on council does. ■ I'm none the wiser after attending 'SuperSeniors' today and why was Alastair Scott there?
Hawkes Bay Today 18/5/16
TEXT US section
■ Treaty settlement. Who's going to gain from that? Should set up jobs for everyone, not just you leaders. Whanau should set up education programme for those struggling to keep kids at kura.